[GPOC] [Pvgreens-discussion] Bob Kinsey's announcement for USSenate seat

[ROBERT KINSEY]

Don't forget your first vote is to Register Green and /or get five new people to do so!


Bob Kinsey
303-949-4073

----------------------------------------
> From: tkelly733 at earthlink.net
> To: sandylemberg at juno.com; willw at riverrock.org
> Date: Sun, 17 Feb 2008 15:45:10 -0700
> CC: grns-gpoc at greens.org; pvgreens-discussion at pvgreens.org
> Subject: Re: [GPOC] [Pvgreens-discussion] Bob Kinsey's announcement for	USSenate seat
> 
> Sandy,
> Well said.  Vote for Kinsey.
> Cheers,
> Tom
> 
> Thomas D. Kelly
> tkelly733 at earthlink.net
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: grns-gpoc-bounces at greens.org [mailto:grns-gpoc-bounces at greens.org] On
> Behalf Of sandylemberg at juno.com
> Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2008 3:30 PM
> To: willw at riverrock.org
> Cc: grns-gpoc at greens.org; pvgreens-discussion at pvgreens.org
> Subject: Re: [GPOC] [Pvgreens-discussion] Bob Kinsey's announcement for
> USSenate seat
> 
> Matsunaka was a bad candidate and he stood in opposition to Green values.
> The same holds for Udall, and everyone knows it now (as opposed to last
> time). You have every right to support Udall but, if you want to be part
> of a group that supports him, that group is clearly the Democratic Party,
> not the Green Party.
> 
> The Greens are not the cause of the defeat of the Democratic Party in
> recent presidential election. Very few people buy into that argument any
> more. The cause was the Democratic Party itself.
> 
> The purpose of the Green Party is to offer people an opportunity to
> promote their values and beliefs in the electoral arena. It is not the
> purpose of the Green Party to support or assist the Democratic Party in
> any way.
> 
> Sandy
> 
> On Sun, 17 Feb 2008 10:48:01 -0700 "Will Walters" 
> writes:
>> My blood runs Green, but I think it would be naive to think that 
>> Kinsey's
>> run for Congress caused a more leftist candidate to run in 2006.  I 
>> think a
>> more leftist candidate ran partly because of coincidence and partly 
>> because
>> there is more energy among grassroots Democrats for more leftist 
>> candidates.
>> I also think it would be naive to rule out the possibility that 
>> Kinsey's
>> candidacy did not affect the 2004 outcome.  His candidacy most likely
>> siphoned time and money and morale from the Matsunaka campaign.  The 
>> old
>> saying, divided we fall.  If Kinsey and his supporters had devoted 
>> the same
>> amount of time and money to supporting Matsunaka's campaign as they 
>> did to
>> Kinsey's, Matsunaka might well have won.  Not that Matsunaka is 
>> green, but
>> blue is a lot closer to green than red is, and Musgrave is very red.
>> 
>> Be the past as it is, I am mainly concerned that we learn from it.  
>> The
>> Great Spirit provided us with an important lesson in the 2000 
>> election and
>> in the years since.  We who supported and voted for Nader, despite 
>> early and
>> often warnings that a Bush victory would lead to untold tragedies, 
>> have
>> blood on our hands.  The votes for Nader did as predicted siphon 
>> away enough
>> votes from Gore in FL and NH to enable a predictable Supreme Court 
>> coup.
>> And over a million people are now dead as an indirect result of our 
>> naivety,
>> or worse yet, callousness to tragedy.  Was such tragedy really 
>> necessary?
>> It is imperative that we set aside our egos, accept that harsh 
>> truth, and
>> not repeat our mistakes.
>> 
>> The United States Senate is arguably the most powerful assembled 100 
>> people
>> on earth.  I believe it is very important that we get the best 
>> possible
>> people into it, those who will work for the greatest percentage of 
>> time
>> promoting the highest good.  To me, that's the big picture we must 
>> not lose
>> sight of.  It is not possible to get Bob Kinsey into it in this 
>> election.
>> We all should know that.  The Green Party is a long ways from that 
>> (and I
>> think, delays its own ascension by trying, since there are better 
>> ways to
>> grow the Green Party, by focusing on local races, for instance; 
>> another
>> discussion).  More importantly, if the Green Party sabotages the 
>> chances of
>> getting the best possible people into the Senate, then we betray our 
>> own
>> values, just as we did in 2000.
>> 
>> There are always trade-offs.  Every day, how we heat our house or 
>> stock our
>> refrigerator or get to work involve compromises for every one of us. 
>>  None
>> of us is without ungreen sin.  As a Congressman, Udall has his 
>> flaws.  But
>> the difference between him and Shaffer is remarkable.  Udall is not 
>> just
>> blue, he is a leader on many green issues.  On the Iraq war, we may 
>> disagree
>> with him, and on impeachment, we may disagree with him (though it 
>> would
>> likely fail and be counter-productive at this point).  But to focus 
>> our
>> actions narrowly on these significant areas of disagreement and lose 
>> sight
>> of the substantial common ground we have with regard to the big 
>> picture, I
>> think would be tragic.
>> 
>> I know there are other respectable viewpoints about this among this 
>> group.
>> But I hope in the end that this one will prevail:  that all of us, 
>> including
>> Bob Kinsey, will speak compellingly and often about what we believe 
>> in, but
>> ultimately endorse and support and vote for Udall, not only as the 
>> best
>> viable alternative to Shaffer, but as a worthy in his own right 
>> (albeit
>> imperfect) representative of our state in the Senate.  Green as my 
>> blood may
>> be, I would not want to see Kinsey's name actually on the ballot 
>> where it
>> could do nothing but cause harm.
>> 
>> My heart,
>> Will Walters
>> 
>> P.S.  Didn't I hear that one of our local Democratic state 
>> legislators is
>> promoting some sort of instant runoff voting pilot program in the
>> legislature?
>> 
>> 
>>   -----Original Message-----
>>   From: pvgreens-discussion-bounces at pvgreens.org
>> [mailto:pvgreens-discussion-bounces at pvgreens.org]On Behalf Of
>> ericfried at comcast.net
>>   Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2008 12:35 AM
>>   To: PV Green Party Discussion List; Darrel Snyder; 
>> kinsey_65 at msn.com
>>   Subject: RE: [Pvgreens-discussion] Bob Kinsey's announcement for 
>> US Senate
>> seat
>> 
>> 
>>   Thanks for the thoughtful comments. I don't recall anything in the
>> Colora-duh-an, but here is the link to the Denver Post article:
>> http://www.denverpost.com/headlines/ci_8169397
>>   I think Bob referenced a "low carbon footprint" not a "low media 
>> imprint"
>> campaign. He does need a major effort, as a Senate race is ten times 
>> the
>> size of a Congressional race. Perhaps you would like to work on his
>> campaign? Submitting the announcement as an Op-ed to every newspaper 
>> in
>> Colorado is a great idea.
>>   As to the spoiler issue, if we always worry how our camapaigns 
>> will affect
>> Democrats, then we have no need to exist as an independent party. But
>> without us, they move even further to the right, because 
>> progressives would
>> have nowhere to go when they sell us out to corporate interests, 
>> time and
>> again. If Udall was voting against war funding and for impeachment, 
>> for
>> instance, Kinsey would not be running. I personally think Green-Dem
>> coalitions where we have common ground makes sense, except the other 
>> side is
>> not interested. They have done nothing to support Instant Runoff 
>> Voting
>> (which eliminates the "spoiler" issue) and even locally we have been
>> rebuffed when trying to work with them on issues like the Fort 
>> Collins Iraq
>> Withdrawal Resolution or educational forums. They just want us to go 
>> away so
>> they can continue to gravitate to the DLC (Democrats who Love 
>> Corporations),
>> where the real money is. Individual Democrats who are progressive 
>> are a
>> different story, and there are some we can work with, and should.
>>   Eric
>>   PS - in 2004 Marilyn won with over 50% of the vote, so Kinsey's 4% 
>> did not
>> cause her to win. In 2006 she got less than 50% due to a 
>> conservative third
>> party candidate, Eric Eidsness running on the Reform Party ticket. 
>> Her
>> challenger then (Angie Paccione) was to the left of the one in 2002 
>> and 2004
>> (Stan Matsunaka)...a result of Kinsey's effort, in part?
>>     -------------- Original message --------------
>>     From: "Darrel Snyder" 
>> 
>>     PVGreens and Candidate Keinsey,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>     Bob Kinsey--Now there is a candidate who represents most of my 
>> feelings
>> and beliefs, one whom I would feel good about voting for and 
>> promoting among
>> friends and neighbors.  I am especially pleased to see his emphasis 
>> on
>> environmental prioritiestaking immediate measures to counter the 
>> man-caused
>> aspects of climate change, a still rapidly growing human population, 
>> and the
>> concept of the need for an ever-growing economy.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>     However, as in 2004, I am also concerned about the Kinsey 
>> campaigns
>> maintenance of a low media imprint.  Such is counter to the need to
>> publicize his candidacy and stance on the various issues to the 
>> public in
>> general, not just those already associated with the Green Party.  
>> Within the
>> financial limits of his campaign and units of the Green Party, his 
>> candidacy
>> must be as visible as possible to be even marginally viable.  Most 
>> citizens
>> believe they only have two realistic choices for most offices in the
>> upcoming elections.  Was this public announcement printed or at least
>> covered by our local newspaper, the Fort Collins Coloradoan  if it 
>> was, I
>> missed it.  If it wasnt, I urge candidate Kinsey and/or PVGreens to 
>> submit
>> it, at least in the editorial (opinion) section.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>     Unfortunately (or perhaps fortunately) I understand candidate 
>> Udall has
>> similar positions and priorities on environmental (and other) 
>> concerns and
>> this puts me, and I expect many others, in a quandary regarding the 
>> upcoming
>> elections.  Would my vote (our votes) for Kinsey effectively help 
>> Schaeffer
>> win office as it did for Musgrave did in 2004, and would it have a 
>> similar
>> detrimental impact while they are in office?   These are urgent 
>> matters, we
>> cant wait for the Green party to become a major factor in state and 
>> federal
>> politics.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>     Perhaps it is not appropriate for me to suggest such (Im not 
>> very
>> politically active except for voting and occasionally writing le-mail
>> messages to my representatives, and I have yet to participate in a 
>> local
>> PVGreen meeting, although I monitor and sometimes respond to e-mail
>> listserve communications), but might not the Green Party and it 
>> state and
>> local units be more productive at the state and federal levels by 
>> forming a
>> coalition with and strongly influencing the platform of the major 
>> party most
>> closely aligned with Green Party valuescurrently the Democratic 
>> Party
>> (perhaps the Republican Party or a powerful assemblage of alternative
>> parties in the future)?  For now, might not forming a Green 
>> Party-Democratic
>> Party coalition for at least selected candidates (those with strong 
>> Green
>> Party values) have a much better chance of defeating Republication 
>> Part y
>> cand idates with opposing values and goals?  In exchange for our 
>> partys
>> support, perhaps their candidates would be willing to compromise on 
>> or give
>> greater emphasis to Green Party valuessurely it is worth seriously 
>> pursuing
>> the possibility.  Through such political coalitions, we could 
>> reinforce and
>> perhaps make the major partys candidates values even greener, 
>> perhaps
>> enough so, that in the more distant future, as our party gains 
>> stronger
>> influence, the major party we align with might reciprocate by 
>> supporting
>> candidates we put forth.  If Im not mistaken, this is effectively 
>> how the
>> Green Party grew to have a strong influence in European politics.  
>> The Green
>> Party in the United States and its significant influence need to 
>> grow much
>> more rapidly than it is; perhaps this is the more expedient and 
>> effective
>> way to do it, maybe the only way to eventually breakdown an 
>> essentially
>> two-party system.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>     I believe most environmentally-oriented voters in this country 
>> feel the
>> only realistic way to get their values represented at the federal, 
>> and
>> perhaps state level, in the short term is by supporting sympathetic
>> Democratic Party candidates, and we members of the Green Party need 
>> to
>> support them as a unit rather than take votes away from them and our 
>> causes.
>> Certainly, when neither major party candidate is Green enough (for 
>> whatever
>> office), I agree that the Green Party needs to offer its own 
>> candidate.
>> But when their values are closely aligned to Green Party values, we 
>> are more
>> likely to have those values represented in government if we 
>> seriously try to
>> reinforce or influence that candidates emphasis on those values and 
>> him or
>> her get elected.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>     Sincerely,
>> 
>>     Darrel Snyder,
>> 
>>     A passive Green Party member
>> 
>>     from Larimer County.
>> 
>> 
>>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---
>> 
>>     From: pvgreens-discussion-bounces at pvgreens.org
>> [mailto:pvgreens-discussion-bounces at pvgreens.org] On Behalf Of
>> ericfried at comcast.net
>>     Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 11:00 PM
>>     To: PV Green Party Discussion List
>>     Subject: [Pvgreens-discussion] Bob Kinsey's announcement for US 
>> Senate
>> seat
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>       -------------- Forwarded Message: --------------
>>       From: "ROBERT KINSEY" 
>>       To: undisclosed-recipients: ;
>>       Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2008 02:58:00 +0000
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>       Bob Kinsey
>>       303-949-4073
> 
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